Marina Cinese

[Brando]

Sul Rid di Novembre c è un'interessantissimo articolo sulla Liaoning, ma nella quarta e quinta foto non si dovrebbe vedere i pennacchi di fumo prodotti dal sistema propulsivo????

 

per la verniciatura, penso che non siano stati verniciati per dar maggiore risalto a quei simboli di cui l'aereo è ricoperto(non sono i soliti simboli che si notano nei crash test?), probabilmente gli servono per fare delle riprese con telecamere ad alta velocità.....

Modificato 25 Novembre 2012 da Brando

[TT-1 Pinto]

Video ....

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVMeKZso1jQ

[cloyce]

Eccovi un video in inglese, pare che il J-15 sarà improntato ad un uso multiruolo.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdfpkgvCf38

[nik978]

Però, seppur pesando meno del su-33 (o meglio, ha un thrust to weight ratio più alto..così dicono), dovrà sempre partire "leggero"...

[cloyce]

In questo TV show, al secondo 00:43 dice che sono 5 i caccia J-15 consegnati alla marina.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSLdrVs4ngQ

 

 

In quest'altra puntata, nei ultimi 5 minuti, fanno trapelare che la prossima generazione di caccia per portaerei sarà il J-31!

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qt2gFl5tiRo

Modificato 26 Novembre 2012 da cloyce

[Andrea75]

Chinese navy fleet enters West Pacific for routine training

 

MISSILE FRIGATE ZHOUSHAN, Nov. 28 (Xinhua) -- A Chinese naval fleet passed through the Miyako Strait and entered West Pacific Ocean for a routine training exercise on Wednesday.

The fleet is carrying out round-the-clock sailing and defense, open sea combat and supply, escort, as well as search and rescue programs.

The fleet comprises of two guided missile destroyers, two missile frigates, a supply ship and shipboard helicopters.

Fleet Commander Qiu Yanpeng, deputy commander of the navy's East China Sea Fleet, said the routine exercise will also be among the fleet's moves to follow the guidelines set by the 18th National Congress of the Communist Party of China.

The training aims to improve the troops' capabilities for long-time, long-distance sea operations and boost confidence for sea missions, according to Qiu.

Conducting training in international waters has been normal practice of different navies of the world, which is in line with international laws.

China's navy has conducted several training exercises in the West Pacific this year.

 

 

Skeptism to China's carrier-borne jet should be mute

 

highlights

• Foreign media reports claimed that China's carrier-borne fighter jet is a copy of a Russian model.

• Those with ulterior motives should not underestimate China's capabilities of independent innovation.

• China's development in military technologies must rely on self-dependent scientific innovation.

BEIJING, Nov. 27 (Xinhua) -- Foreign media reports have claimed that China's new J-15 carrier-borne fighter jet is merely a copy of a Russian model. Such an assertion is groundless and sour.

 

The J-15 made its debut in a landing and take-off exercise on China's aircraft carrier, the Liaoning, last weekend.

Chinese people hailed the successful test that makes the country one of the few around the world to operate carrier-borne jets.

It is not surprising that some western media quickly responded to the inspiring news with criticism and taunts, since the J-15, with an unfinished coating during the exercise had a similar aerodynamic shape with the Russian Su-33 jet.

There is always criticism of China for the crime of "plagiarism" when the country makes progress in military hardware development, questioning China's respect to others' intellectual property rights and belittling the hardware's technological and tactical qualities.

The criticism is also not surprising because China has often achieved progress within a much shorter period of time than what it usually has taken some western countries to do.

It is true that China used to rely heavily on imported Russian military aircraft, warships and other hardware to modernize its troops due to a lack of independent innovation abilities.

But people should not use that as an excuse for criticising Chinese people who have made tough endeavors and even sacrifices in developing the J-15's engine, fire-control system, electronics system and other key components.

With years of research and experiment, China has already made breakthroughs in manufacturing home-made turbofan engines which provides high-performance home-made fighter jets with a strong "heart."

On Sunday, chief of the J-15 project Luo Yang died of heart attack on the carrier's voyage return to base after the landing exercise, which gives a mournful example of how hard Chinese scientific personnel have worked under high pressure.

Those with ulterior motives should never underestimate China's capabilities of independent innovation in national defense technologies.

China developed nuclear weapons and artificial satellites when the country was still in poverty and hardship. It has also made significant breakthroughs in a series of key technologies, including the manned space program.

Undoubtedly, the history of mankind is a process of learning from each other, borrowing ideas mutually and developing one's own technologies by absorbing other's advantages.

China has spread its own wisdom and civilization throughout the world such as the "four great inventions," and no one criticized that other countries copied the Chinese.

But some countries have long remained hostile and precautious toward China. They constantly fabricate sayings of "military spy" and "technical plagiarism" and speaking negatively of China with the purpose of extending technological blockade and halting the country's development of advanced military science.

Some military powers also press on curbing China's military progress in order to retain their position as world's top countries in key military technologies.

Therefore China's development in military technologies must rely on self-dependent scientific innovation.

According to President Hu Jintao's report to the 18th National Congress of the Communist Party of China, China will "strengthen the development of new- and high-technology weapons and equipment and enhance the capacity for innovation in defense-oriented research and industries."

Just as Hu's report said, the ultimate objective of China's endeavors to develop military hardware is "to safeguard China's sovereignty, security and territorial integrity and ensure its peaceful development."

China will be more confident and capable to curb war and safeguard world peace and security through peaceful means with its modernization of national defense and its military building stepping forward.

Modificato 28 Novembre 2012 da Andrea75

[cloyce]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDFkPJddS08

Disegnare portaerei con la sabbia non è mai stata così spettacolare!

[Andrea75]

China Makes Preparations for Aircraft Carrier Formation

 

Within only a month, the development of China’s aircraft carrier experienced the official delivery of the “Liaoning Ship” to the Navy of the Chinese People’s Liberation Army (PLA) and the successful taking-off and landing training of the carrier-borne J-15 fighter nicknamed “Flying Shark” on the deck of the aircraft carrier. Western observers feel astonished at the speed of the development of China’s aircraft carrier and no longer doubt that China’s first aircraft carrier formation will debut in the near future.

A naval open-sea taskforce mainly composed of warships from the East China Sea Fleet under the PLA Navy sailed to the vast waters of the West Pacific Ocean and carried out routine drills again on November 28, 2012. During the open-sea training, the taskforce conducted training on such subjects as round-the-clock navigation and defense, open-sea combat and supply and escort for large surface ship. Military experts speculate that such open-sea training may be the preparation for the building of China’s first aircraft carrier formation.

Various fleets started mission-oriented formation drills

Actually, various fleets under the PLA Navy had begun mission-oriented drills before the commissioning of the “Liaoning Ship”. Especially in recent years, the lineup and formation, communication and command and combined tactics of large surface ship taskforce have become the basic components of open-sea training of the PLA Navy.

A joint taskforce under the North China Sea Fleet of the PLA Navy consisting of seven warships, including the “Harbin” and “Shijiazhuang” guided missile destroyers, also carried out coordinated training among multiple arms in the waters of the West Pacific Ocean in early October. Obviously, with the official delivery of the aircraft carrier “Liaoning Ship”, the PLA Navy will timely carry out joint taskforce drill between the “Liaoning Ship” and other surface ships.

Most of the main active warships can be incorporated into the aircraft carrier formation

Based on the existing PLA naval ships, the “Liaoning Ship” has been able to be built into a formation focusing on control of the air and the sea in accordance with task requirements.

Judging from the warships’ performances and experience, most of the main active warships of the three major fleets under the PLA Navy can be incorporated into the aircraft carrier formation, such as the guided missile destroyers “Lanzhou” (170 warship) and “Haikou” (171 warship), nicknamed the “China’s aegis” of the South China Sea Fleet. All the comprehensive supply ships in various fleets, such as the “Hongze Lake” comprehensive supply ship (881 warship), can undertake the open-sea comprehensive supply for the aircraft carrier formation.

Future aircraft carrier formation will be composed of latest-type warships

Restricted by such factors as the experience of aircraft carrier operations and the number of the PLA main naval ships, China’s aircraft carrier formation will be kept in an appropriate scale, and mainly composed of the “Liaoning Ship”, four to six guided missile destroyers and guided missile frigates, one to two nuclear attack submarines or new-type conventional submarines and one comprehensive supply ship. The formation will be constantly tested and adjusted during training.

Compared with that of the U.S. Navy, the first aircraft carrier formation of the Chinese Navy will have more experimental and transitional characteristics.

With the increasingly accelerated modernization of the PLA naval ships, the future aircraft carrier formation will be composed of China’s latest-type surface ships and new-type nuclear attack submarines. Large amphibious warfare ships and open-sea comprehensive supply ships will also be included in the formation.

Undoubtedly, combat effectiveness is the unique yardstick, whether the future aircraft carrier formation is based on the active warships or on new-type information-based warships. The PLA Navy has just taken its first step in building the aircraft carrier formation, and it will need at least five to ten years before the aircraft carrier formation has the real combat effectiveness and comprehensive attack-and-defense capabilities in coastal waters and open-sea.

[cloyce]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eoeEj9f0MFI

 

Un video 3D sulla portaerei cinese.

[Andrea75]

Russia Sells New Subs To China

 

In the December 20th edition of the Russian newspaper “Kommersant” was a story claiming that Russia and China have signed a memorandum of understanding on the sale of four Amur-class (Project 677E) diesel electric attack submarines to China.

The Russian-language article can be viewed at this link.

“Although the fact that the deal exists is true, some details in the article might be wrong,” warned Vasiliy Kashin, a China military specialist at the Moscow-based Centre for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies (CAST). “I’m not sure, for example, that the Amurs, which will be assembled in China, will be fitted with the Chinese AIP [air independent propulsion] systems using Stirling engines.”

The Chinese have expressed interest in Russian research in this field in the past, which might mean that their Stirling systems are not that reliable, he said. “Compared to Kilo submarines, Amur subs are quieter, have more efficient batteries, much better electronic equipment and other features.”

Kashin said that it was likely that follow-on procurements of more Amurs were possible, due to the fact that China’s domestic production of indigenous submarines is “plagued with…problems.” So the initial four Amurs might follow the same pattern as China’s procurement of Kilo-class submarines in the 1990s from Russia, which started at two 877EKM models then expanded to ten 636M models.

[TT-1 Pinto]

La Cina affonda una portaerei americana .... nel deserto del Gobi ....

 

 

China Tests Carrier Killer DF-21D Missile; Sinks US Aircraft Carrier ....

 

Fonte .... http://blogs.defensenews.com/intercepts/2013/01/china-tests-carrier-killer-df-21d-missile-sinks-us-aircraft-carrier/

 

[vorthex]

sbaglio o è il photoshop di una foto già nota da tempo?

indubbiamente, ammesso che le proporzioni siano esatte, un risultato pregevole per un IRBM, roba da Pershing II (tralasciamo che sia di quasi 30anni fa).

unico appunto: le portaerei non sono mica ferme e peccato che non si sappia niente sul sistema di guida terminale del famigerato missile in questione... chissà perchè.

Modificato 31 Gennaio 2013 da vorthex

[nik978]

La foto della sola piattafroma era già nella discussione sul DF-21. (non riesco a recuperarla ora perchè sono un attimo di fretta).

 

Il problema sta tutto in quei 30 nodi di velocità massima di una portaerei e quei secondi dal rientro in atmosfera del missile. sono quasi 60km/h.. di strada se ne fa tanta a quella velocità e se si parla di un missile "convenzionale" che deve comunque colpire l'obbiettivo, si deve arrivare manovrati fino a poco prima dell'impatto...

 

ANhce io alla vista della foto originale non mi ero impressionato più di tanto proprio perchè il problema è che la portaerei mica sta ferma ad aspettare.

 

 

[madmike]

Ricordo però che i cinesi hanno parlato del DF21, ma che il grande allarme venne da parte USA (Rand in primis) che vedevano questa cosa come una minaccia mortale.

 

Sulla velocità, i 30 nodi (che non è che vengano tenuti sempre....) sono appunto ca. 60 kmh: un IRBM in fase di rientro fa 4\5 km AL SECONDO, quindi il movimento della nave è, nelle ultime fasi, ininfluente.

 

Il vero problema è al momento del lancio e la fase di guida intermedia, perchè se è vero che lo IRBM vola per qualche minuto, e avrà una guida inerziale, poi viene lanciato verso una certa zona: il vero problema (che se l'hanno risolto, lo hanno risolto solo i cinesi) è la guida terminale, e manovrata, di un vettore che arriva a velocità spaventosa e con un apparato di guida che deve avere

 

A) UNA portata notevole

 

B) una capacità di influire sulla manovra del missile praticamente istantanea.

 

Sembra tanto, per una cosa che nessuno è mai riuscito a mettere in pratica.

[nik978]

Diciamo che gli USA hanno sempre fatto le loro mosse preventive anche con notizie o "voci" non confermate.In passato era successo anche per, se ricordo bene, il mig-25.. credo che i militari per convincere il governo a stanziare dei fondi debbano comunque farla sempre un po più "grossa"...

 

Perchè tutte le considerazioni fatte sono, anche per un profano, abbastanza chiare e difficilissime da risolvere.. e immagino lo siano anche per i militari!

[nik978]

Fresco fresco da china daily. ok non è un articolo tecnico, ma meglio che niente.

 

 

Modificato 21 Aprile 2013 da nik978

[cloyce]

Ecco un video sul centro di addestramento per piloti di J-15

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=AVUPr-LCz-w

[TT-1 Pinto]

Lo ski-jump di Saki (Crimea) ....

 

 

 

[nik978]

per saperne di più sl "carrier style" 航母style

 

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/shootering-aircraft-carrier-style-%E8%88%AA%E6%AF%8Dstyle

 

immagini

http://www.google.com.hk/search?q=%E8%88%AA%E6%AF%8Dstyle&newwindow=1&safe=strict&client=firefox-a&hs=tF8&rls=org.mozilla:it:official&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=UKV0UeSuOOLZigfKiYDgDg&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAQ&biw=1366&bih=630

 

 

 

[TT-1 Pinto]

per saperne di più sl "carrier style" 航母style

 

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/shootering-aircraft-carrier-style-%E8%88%AA%E6%AF%8Dstyle

 

immagini

http://www.google.com.hk/search?q=%E8%88%AA%E6%AF%8Dstyle&newwindow=1&safe=strict&client=firefox-a&hs=tF8&rls=org.mozilla:it:official&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=UKV0UeSuOOLZigfKiYDgDg&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAQ&biw=1366&bih=630

 

 

 

 

Boh .... alle volte l'orgoglio può giocare strani scherzi ....

 

.... un tempo queste cose le chiamavamo .... americanate ....

[nik978]

sono molto molto piu' simili di quanto non vogliano fare credere.. sono dei fantastici creatori di "meme"......

[Vultur]

Che risate la prossima sono le torte in faccia tra avieri e marinai?

 

Il J-15 mi pare che ha l'ala ripiegabile in due punti a fisarmonica. Sul Su-33 io questo non l'ho mai visto, quindi forse il gigante dei mari Miaoning o ha un hangar più basso o porte più strette.

[nik978]

Rispetto alla "mamma" Kutznestov", la Lianoning ha decisamente ridotto le difese attive. La particolarità della versione russa era una grossa quantità di missili, sam, tubi lancio, gun etc,,. Quindi probabilmente ha più spazio interno e magari le due cose assieme, ali j-15 e meno tubi lancio, vogliono dire che può imbarcare più aerei..

[-{-Legolas-}-]

Dal Daily Telegraph. La Liaoning potrebbe partire per una lunga crociera in corrispondenza col 64esimo anniversario della Marina Cinese, che potrebbe comprendere Guam e Okinawa. Il suo capitano Zhang Zheng, commenta così:"A big country cannot do without aircraft carriers", mentre il Primo Ufficiale Liu Zhigang dice che:"serve as a guide for the transformation of the Chinese navy, from coastal defence to greater responsibilities in deep oceans."

 

Curiosità: la Liaoning è molto "pulita" per essere una nave da guerra, sembra uscita da un manga giapponese. Vedi foto.

 

[nik978]

anni fa ero in gita su un'isoletta per meta' militare e meta' no.. bunker dismessi e una innocua caserma nella parte civile e chissa' cosa in quella militare

 

C'erano dei soldati che tutti i giorni A MANO pulivano ogni angolo delle stradine di campagna, tenute abbastanza male visto che il livello di pulizia media delle "deep countryside" cinesi e' abbastanza basso.

Le strade gestite dai soldati erano a specchio

Idem i camion militari che si incrociano in giro. sono sempre cosi' puliti da sembrare nuovi.......

 

Ecco queste foto mi ricordano queste immagini di cui parlavo sopra.... indubbiamente.